OnCourse Software

Ok how do i add waypoints again bud?

Also this doesn't say you have to do this in the manual?

ok i done it

I had a go at this approach in my sim. Adding the STAR waypoints makes little difference, you will still get vectored halfway between WCO an HON. Reason is that PFE likes the last waypoint in the plan to be about 20-30 nm from the airport. HON/EBONY/GROVE are too close. This is totally realistic ATC behaviour to vector you while you are in the process of flying a STAR, but is clearly not what you want.

If you want to fly a STAR this close to the airport do the following:

1. Use you original FSX plan to compile (the one where the last waypoint in the plan is WCO).

2.Do NOT select a start of STAR in the waypoints adjustment page.

3. In the SIDS/STARS page tick the STARS Active box.

What will happen now is that at WCO you will be told you are cleared to finals at your discretion, and that you must contact tower when established on finals. You can now fly your STAR and approach to RWY, and when you are established on the ILS you contact tower.

Mate you are a legend thanks very much couldn't of done it without you! I will try that tonight

One other thing do you use the 737 ngx?

driver170 wrote:

One other thing do you use the 737 ngx?

I am using FS9, not FSX. I have invested too much time (and money) on addon scenery, mesh, general scenery enhancements; payware aircraft; and AI aircraft and flightplans to make the switch away from FS9.

I do however fly the PMDG 737-800/900 FS9 version, which is very similar to the NGX, as well as their 747 and MD-11.

Whats fs9? 2004?

Cool so you can hopefully answer my question. PFE always descends me early from my TOD do you use level change or stay in vnav? If i stay in vnav and go to the des page the a/c descends at a shallow rate 1000 fpm till it intercepts the glide path but i always arrive way too high that way.

driver170 wrote:

Whats fs9? 2004?

Cool so you can hopefully answer my question. PFE always descends me early from my TOD do you use level change or stay in vnav? If i stay in vnav and go to the des page the a/c descends at a shallow rate 1000 fpm till it intercepts the glide path but i always arrive way too high that way.

First thing to note is that the FMC VNAV PATH has little correlation to any ATC instructions. The only time they will be "in line" is where you have altitude restrictions in the PFE flightplan that you have also put into the FMC. You will find then that the ATC instructions will match pretty well with your VNAV PATH. PFE (just like in the real world) may ask you to descend early or late compared to your FMC calculated TOD point. It will also randomly ask you to descend "at your discretion". You can then choose to use DES NOW, or to wait until the TOD point.

If you are arriving close to your final waypoint "too high", there are a few things which you can do.

1. Before you start your flight, make sure any important altitude restrictions (especially at the last few waypoints) are the same in the PFE plan and your FMC. Your FMC will initially show calculated altitudes for waypoints (unless they are hard altitudes for a STAR), you may wish to make these hard altitudes by overwriting them.

2. If you are flying with a weather addon, make sure you put descent altitude winds into the FMC before you descend. Strong winds will make your VNAV PATH profile incorrect if you fail to do so.

3. Descending through 10,000 feet can sometimes be problematic, as you have to both descend and slow down. If you think you are getting too high in this process or not slowing quickly enough, then use speedbrakes.

4. Just as in the real world you will sometimes get instructed to descend quickly. The quickest (in terms of vertical speed) way to descend in this situation is to switch to LVL CHG, and fly at the maximum permitted speed, whether that be 320 kias or 250 kias below 10,000. Again using speedbrakes if needed.

So to answer your question..... if you follow the advice in 1. above, then you should stay in VNAV and use DES NOW. If further on in the descent you need to descend quicker, then switch to LVL CHG.

It may help if you give an example of exactly where during the descent you feel you "arrived too high". It may simply be that you need more experience in getting the aircraft to descend and slow down at the same time. The 737 series aircraft are well known for not wanting to do this, and in this respect you are flying a very accurately modelled addon !

Have a look at your picture of the PFE plan you linked to earlier in this thread.

You changed the altitude for WCO to 2000. You left unchanged the 18000 altitude for the previous waypoint COWLY. So you are asking ATC to descend you from 18000 to 2000 over a 27nm distance, during which you will have to slow to 250 knots. That is going to be very very difficult for any aircraft to achieve, let alone the 737.

I think thats where i had gone wrong putting 2000 in the last waypoint? But thats what i was told to enter the FAF alt in the last waypoint? I think i'll manage better next time as i'll enter the STAR waypoints.

What i've been doing is just entering the ILS altitude for the FAF but hey its a learning curve righ? And glad i have you to help dude.

I use the navigraph airac so am upto date and my FMC has all the hard altitude in the FMC i will just add them into PFE.

So what altitude will i actually put in for the last waypoint if it doesn't have a hard restriction?