OnCourse Software

Hello,

I have been using this product for around a year and I have really struggled with trying to get it set up correctly. Many times I will be four or 5 miles from the airport and I will still be at 20,000 feet versus a lower altitude to land. I know I am missing something but I’m wondering if there is a really good tutorial that tells you how to edit flight plans, so PF3 gives you the correct altitudes. I use simbrief for my flight plans and am using steam FSX. So basically, I am looking for a really good tutorial that will tell me how to set up PF3 so that it gives me the correct altitudes and instructions. I know it is me making a mistake, not the program, lol any help would be appreciated.

There are a few tutorials listed under 'Useful Links'

viewtopic.php?t=1865

Also, if you have a problem with altitudes it's probably best to start with providing us with a debug log so we can see exactly what's happening, as it may be something very simple. Usually it's best to leave PF3 to handle your climb/descent profiles, but obviously there are exceptions

woyzeck42 wrote: *

Sun Oct 23, 2022 9:28 am

Many times I will be four or 5 miles from the airport and I will still be at 20,000 feet versus a lower altitude to land.

As you said these problems are usually related to issues with the flight plan, such as waypoints too close to the destination airport or having a STAR included in a flight plan when it shouldn't be. If you are using Simbrief it often includes the SID and STAR in your flight plan and that can cause problems for PF3. For best results your last PF3 waypoint should be about 30-40 miles from the destination airport. See also section 20.5 in the User Guide for tips on SID/STAR use. As Dave said if you continue to have problems, provide a log so we can see if the flight plan is the issue or if something else is going on.

Thanks for the feedback. So one option would be to use simbrief with no Sid/stars and then add them in manually into the FMC. Would that help? I will send log later today.

The PF3 flight plan page has a waypoint removal feature that allows you to selectively remove (or deactivate) waypoints from the PF3 flight plan even if they are included in the flight planner output and you have them in your FMC. You can remove from the PF3 flight plan waypoints that are too close to the destination airport (anything closer than 20 miles is likely to cause problems). The handling of STARs depends on where you are flying. When flying in Europe it's usually best to leave the STAR out of the PF3 flight plan entirely, but this isn't feasible in the U.S. and Canada because the STARs are so long. In these cases you will include much of the STAR in the flight plan and deactivate waypoints that are too close to the airport. Section 20.5 in the User Guide provides more info.

All:

Thank you very much for your excellent feedback. I will try flight plan from simbrief with no SID/STARS . Please also see my debug log.

Thanks,

Rich

I took a look at your debug log and here a few things I noticed:

You never reached your cruise altitude of FL360. ATC kept nagging you to climb to FL360 but you didn't go above FL350, and then you never got descent instructions. Did you reset your altimeter to standard (29.92) above 18,000?

You have altitudes set for the cruise phase and it may not be necessary as PF3 will step you up to cruise.

The altitudes you entered for the descent phase don't make sense - you look like you are descending, then climbing, then descending again.
Original Alt (see FPP) for WP 14 changed to: 35200
Original Alt (see FPP) for WP 15 changed to: 23500
Original Alt (see FPP) for WP 16 changed to: 30500
Original Alt (see FPP) for WP 17 changed to: 13300

Your last waypoint is only 15 miles out. I'd suggest you deactivate the waypoints after MYNEE on the PF3 flight plan page, so your last WP is 29 miles out. If you uncheck the STAR box at the bottom of the SID/STAR page, PF3 will begin vectoring you for the approach when you reach MYNEE. With the STAR box checked, as you have it now, you won't get vectors. You will be cleared to fly the approach on your own.

Oops, I misspoke above and can't edit it.

Dan77 wrote: *

Mon Oct 24, 2022 4:23 pm

You have altitudes set for the cruise phase and it may not be necessary as PF3 will step you up to cruise.

I meant you have altitudes set for the CLIMB phase and it may not be necessary as PF3 will step you up to cruise. You can usually leave the altitudes for the climb phase unchanged.

Dan,

Thank you very much. I will delete the waypoints and try the flight again. When using simbrief I assume it’s better to load a flight plan without Sid and stars correct?

woyzeck42 wrote: *

Mon Oct 24, 2022 8:42 pm

When using simbrief I assume it’s better to load a flight plan without Sid and stars correct?

When flying in Europe, probably yes. In the U.S. and Canada, no, because the SIDs and STARs can be hundreds of miles long. Your current flight KSAN-KOAK is almost all SID and STAR. The SID is about 125 miles long and the STAR about 150, so without them you will have nothing left. You should keep most of the SID and STAR and simply deactivate or remove the waypoints that are within about 25 miles of the airports.

This is what I'd suggest: On the PF3 flight plan page, remove or deactivate the waypoints after MYNEE. Your last waypoint will be about 29 miles from KOAK. You still have most of the SID and STAR included. Remove all of the altitudes you entered on the waypoint page and just use PF3's altitudes. If you uncheck the STARs box at the bottom of the SID/STAR page before the flight, PF3 will begin vectoring you after you reach MYNEE and you won't fly the rest of the waypoints in your FMC; just follow ATC turn instructions and you will be vectored to the active runway. Also during the flight be sure you reach your cruise altitude on standard altimeter. Hopefully this will work and you will have a better experience than your other flights.