OnCourse Software

dmarch wrote:

jgoggi wrote:

- Never heard the departure controller giving QNH
- When on a SID it's absolutely incorrect to hear the departure controller say "resume own navigation", while it's correct after giving headings.

Well I don't think we have anything else in the can to use in place of Resume own navigation

After reading various parts of the net, I must admit that there is not much information about this situation available, which possibly means that nothing should be said here (as jgoggi suggested), but in https://forums.vatsim.net/viewtopic.php?p=32980 I found "proceed as filed" and "proceed direct to (next waypoint name)".

So maybe "continue as filed":
pfchat556=continue
pfchat558=as filed

Or "continue direct to (next waypoint name)":
pfchat556=continue
pfchat566=direct to

Further discussion about this:
http://www.pprune.org/archive/index.php/t-14771.html
http://www.pprune.org/archive/index.php/t-15721.html
Here people seem to agree that "Resume own navigation" should (or has to?) be followed by a "to XYZ" or "direct to XYZ" and only happens after being radar vectored, which I read as not after a SID.

So I would propose:
Find the next waypoint name.
If found:
- after vectoring (no SID), issue "Resume own navigation to XYZ"
- after a SID, issue "continue direct to XYZ"
If not found (can this happen? maybe on very short flight plans?):
- after vectoring (no SID), issue "Resume own navigation"
- after a SID, issue "continue as filed"

dmarch wrote:

Well I don't think we have anything else in the can to use in place of Resume own navigation

Well, simply nothing, that sentence is useless...

jgoggi wrote:

dmarch wrote:

Well I don't think we have anything else in the can to use in place of Resume own navigation

Well, simply nothing, that sentence is useless...

No I kinda like it as it is thanks!

ThomasAH wrote:

dmarch wrote:

jgoggi wrote:

- Never heard the departure controller giving QNH
- When on a SID it's absolutely incorrect to hear the departure controller say "resume own navigation", while it's correct after giving headings.

Well I don't think we have anything else in the can to use in place of Resume own navigation

After reading various parts of the net, I must admit that there is not much information about this situation available, which possibly means that nothing should be said here (as jgoggi suggested), but in https://forums.vatsim.net/viewtopic.php?p=32980 I found "proceed as filed" and "proceed direct to (next waypoint name)".

So maybe "continue as filed":
pfchat556=continue
pfchat558=as filed

Or "continue direct to (next waypoint name)":
pfchat556=continue
pfchat566=direct to

Further discussion about this:
http://www.pprune.org/archive/index.php/t-14771.html
http://www.pprune.org/archive/index.php/t-15721.html
Here people seem to agree that "Resume own navigation" should (or has to?) be followed by a "to XYZ" or "direct to XYZ" and only happens after being radar vectored, which I read as not after a SID.

So I would propose:
Find the next waypoint name.
If found:
- after vectoring (no SID), issue "Resume own navigation to XYZ"
- after a SID, issue "continue direct to XYZ"
If not found (can this happen? maybe on very short flight plans?):
- after vectoring (no SID), issue "Resume own navigation"
- after a SID, issue "continue as filed"

I agree!

I personally like "resume your own navigation" which I have heard from ATC many times in real life. That tells me if I was given a heading and vector after departure, that I can now set auto pilot to follow the GPS track rather than heading mode.

bobsk8 wrote:

I personally like "resume your own navigation" which I have heard from ATC many times in real life. That tells me if I was given a heading and vector after departure, that I can now set auto pilot to follow the GPS track rather than heading mode.

Yes and I also believe it is much easier for those who may not be aware of RW procedures to understand... and there are many of us in the sim world! If you're departing without using a SID, ATC will give you instructions up to a certain point, then tell you to 'Resume own navigation'... which makes sense. The same if you are departing using a published procedure, once you complete that procedure what do you do next? If ATC say nothing at all my guess is a lot of users will simply just keep going on their last heading! Whereas if ATC say 'Resume own navigation' then it's perfectly clear to all IMO.

dmarch wrote:

bobsk8 wrote:

I personally like "resume your own navigation" which I have heard from ATC many times in real life. That tells me if I was given a heading and vector after departure, that I can now set auto pilot to follow the GPS track rather than heading mode.

Yes and I also believe it is much easier for those who may not be aware of RW procedures to understand... are there are many of us in the sim world! If you're departing without using a SID, ATC will give you instructions up to a certain point, then tell you to 'Resume own navigation'... which makes sense. The same if you are departing using a published procedure, once you complete that procedure what do you do next? If ATC say nothing at all my guess is a lot of users will simply just keep going on their last heading! Whereas if ATC say 'Resume own navigation' then it's perfectly clear to all IMO.

Exactly, a good way to be told to report to the FAA when you land, is to change headings on your own after you are given a heading to fly by ATC.

jgoggi wrote:

- Never heard the departure controller giving QNH
- When on a SID it's absolutely incorrect to hear the departure controller say "resume own navigation", while it's correct after giving headings.

Actually you can hear it at the end of a SID. Or alternatively if the controller intervenes and directs you away from the SID he will say it at some point.
Probably the only time you wouldn't hear it in comparison with PF3 is at the end of a STAR. In PF3 the problem it has is that it doesn't know the height of the local terrrain so it compensates by giving you the option to navigate arround the high terrain and thus signals "Resume own navigation" as prompt for you.
Never heard the departure controller giving QNH I have!

I filed a wish list entry in the internal forum for this:

ThomasAH wrote:

After reading various parts of the net, I must admit that there is not much information about this situation available, which possibly means that nothing should be said here (as jgoggi suggested), but in https://forums.vatsim.net/viewtopic.php?p=32980 I found "proceed as filed" and "proceed direct to (next waypoint name)".

So maybe "continue as filed":
pfchat556=continue
pfchat558=as filed

Or "continue direct to (next waypoint name)":
pfchat556=continue
pfchat566=direct to

Further discussion about this:
http://www.pprune.org/archive/index.php/t-14771.html
http://www.pprune.org/archive/index.php/t-15721.html
Here people seem to agree that "Resume own navigation" should (or has to?) be followed by a "to XYZ" or "direct to XYZ" and only happens after being radar vectored, which I read as not after a SID.

So I would propose:
Find the next waypoint name.
If found:
- after vectoring (no SID), issue "Resume own navigation to XYZ"
- after a SID, issue "continue direct to XYZ"
If not found (can this happen? maybe on very short flight plans?):
- after vectoring (no SID), issue "Resume own navigation"
- after a SID, issue "continue as filed"

This way even with SIDs PF3 still says something useful, but avoids "Resume own navigation" being given without being vectored first.

ThomasAH wrote:

This way even with SIDs PF3 still says something useful, but avoids "Resume own navigation" being given without being vectored first.

The point is Thomas that "Resume own navigation" is a valid phrase by itself. And its meaning is quite clear. If I am flying a SID then the last SID wypt coincides with the first wypt of the flightplan so "Resume own navigation" is quite correct here when you reach the SID ceiling. The only time PF3 uses it incorrectly (which was brought up during the beta) is during the approach phase where
"continue (pfchat238=until established on the ILS
pfchat239=until established on the ILS/DME
pfchat240=until established on the Localizer)":
could/should be substituted.