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ATC goes dead mid-flights
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Author:  martinlest [ Wed Nov 06, 2013 12:45 pm ]
Post subject:  ATC goes dead mid-flights
On many flights (across land, not ocean), ATC seems to stop responding. Today, I was cleared to FL330, but the call to climb to cruise altitude never happened. I pressed the '0' key, the pilot sent a 'with you' message, but there was no reply. Same for 'Please repeat': the pilot asks, no response.

I am in Auto2 mode and the radio frequency switches seem to happen OK, automatically.

Usually ATC comes back at some stage near TOD and I am asked to descend, but why the lack of response in the middle of the flight? I should have at least been cleared to cruise level., no? I am not asking for flight level changes en route.

Thanks!

Martin
Author:  martinlest [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: ATC goes dead mid-flights
No ideas? Still happens quite regularly. Just flew CYSB to CYAM. PFE's ATC cleared me to FL120, 'expect FL200', but I wait at 120 in vain. None of the usual ways of contacting ATC via the keyboard meet with any response, though the pilot's request comes over OK. I got no more from ATC until I landed at CYAM and tuned manually to the ground frequency (I taxied quite some distance, wondering if PFE would kick in and tune to CYAM ground, but no).

Maybe PFE is not retuning the frequency (I have this set to full auto mode)? What frequency should I tune to manually when I am holding at a given altitude and wnat to 'nudge' ATCto clear me up to my cruise altitude (or start my descent)?

Any ideas what I may be doing wrong to cause this to happen? It's not every flight.. maybe one in three or four..

M.
Author:  Dave March [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 10:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: ATC goes dead mid-flights
Hi Martin,

It sounds to me that you either hadn't reach the last assigned altitude... maybe you missed it... maybe there's a missing wav file so it was never played... or even a flight plan issue or pilot issue where you haven't reached the 'next' waypoint that PFE is expecting you too. I should be able to tell if you send me the debug log for that flight. If you've done another flight since the problem you'll need to send the old log and if you've done more than one flight please recreate and send me the log straight aweay.
Author:  martinlest [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 11:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: ATC goes dead mid-flights
Thanks for the reply & assistance Dave.

I attained FL120 (checking QNS) and waited.. I think I passed all my waypoints (according to FS Navigator). Anyway, the flight I mentioned was the most recent so I will send you the log.

Martin
Author:  martinlest [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 11:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: ATC goes dead mid-flights
... BTW, one thing that (very) often happens, which may or may not be a factor, is that TGS sends me to some strange spot in the airport for take-off. Nowhere near the runway for the addon airport, nor anywhere near for the default AP******.bgl file either (I check in AFCAD2). Very odd - it's like this for easily over half the airports I fly from or to. Why is this? Where is TGS getting its odd Start Location information from?? If I knew I could perhaps troubleshoot this a bit myslef.

Anyway, I have to ignore TGS instructions, and when I get to the assigned runway, I manually retune to the Tower frequency (or sometimes PFE retunes itself anyway) and request take-off. Positive ATC response... When I take off, even so, I get a message that 'TGS has been deactivated'.

That said, ATC is usually fine for the first few legs of the journey: I would have thought that if TGS were a part of the problem, I wouldn't get any ATC interaction after take-off at all..

Martin
Author:  Dave March [ Fri Nov 29, 2013 9:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ATC goes dead mid-flights
TGS gets the taxiway info from the files created by Makerwys.
Author:  martinlest [ Wed Jan 01, 2014 3:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ATC goes dead mid-flights
OK, a bit more info on what seems to be going wrong ... I am still having the same problems with ATC going dead at some stage during the flight. No response to any of my input (asking 'say again' or giving my position with the '0' key). Total silence.

These are extracts from the log, starting a COM freq instruction that worked:

01/01/2014 15:19:15: 020 - Transcript: 'Iberia 200 Contact BARCELONA CONTROL on 132.2'
01/01/2014 15:19:20: 150 - --> subPlayDigits called with value: 132
01/01/2014 15:19:20: 150 - --> subPlayDigits called with value: 2
01/01/2014 15:19:20: 200 -
01/01/2014 15:19:20: 200 - SayPFSentence:- ProFlightR\pf1A,ProFlightR\pf3A,ProFlightR\pf2A,ProFlightR\pfpntA,ProFlightR\pf2A,ProFlightR\pfac38A,ProFlightR\pf2A,ProFlightR\pf0A,ProFlightR\pf0A,ProFlightR\pfchat145A,pfclick
01/01/2014 15:19:20: 200 -
01/01/2014 15:19:20: 200 - Transcript: '132.2 Iberia 200 Good day '
01/01/2014 15:19:26: 240 - COM Freq changed to: 132.2 IPC Set: 12825
01/01/2014 15:19:27: 250 - Not tuned to any 'active' ATC facility!
01/01/2014 15:19:28: 250 - COM Freq changed to: 132.2001 IPC Set: 12832

Then,a few minutes later, as ATC had gone quiet for a while, I tried some input (via the '0' key):

01/01/2014 15:21:58: 120 - Transcript: 'BARCELONA CONTROL Iberia 200 with you level Flight Level 180'
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 200 - Now expecting response from ATC center... iclr=1
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 200 - Trans_Freq: 6265 Req: 6265
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 220 - iRadar set to '1' at #1
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 230 - CheckOnCourse set at #999999
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 230 - INITIAL VECTOR **************** AirwayHdg: 260 Course: 260
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 230 - About to tell you where to go...
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 230 - ComFreq: 132.2 iDepF: 118.6 iAppF: 118.15 iApp: 1 iDepFL: 118.6 iAppFL: 124.02 iAppL: 1 iCtrF: 132.2 iCtr: 1
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 230 - CheckOnCourse set at #51
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 230 - InitialVector set to '0' at #1
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 230 - Setting iApp=iWPt1 A - Cmd0
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 230 - Setting iApp=iWPt1 B - Cmd0
01/01/2014 15:22:06: 230 - Setting iApp=0 at COMF!=iAppF/L - Cmd0
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 250 - --> ****** Backup call terminator triggered #2!
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 250 - Active sentence...#2
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 270 - Zap bad call: ProFlightN\pfac38A,ProFlightN\pf2A,ProFlightN\pf0A,ProFlightN\pf0A,pfclick
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 300 - Checking compliance - Alt: 17992 sWPAlt: 18000 FlightType: 1 ATC_Timer: 0 AltTimer: 0 FSTime: 55327 AptSighted: 0 Handoff: 0
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 300 - Into GH 3
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 340 - ***********************
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 340 - Checking Dist from sWPoLat and sWPLat: 41.9458
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 340 - iClassRad0T: 40
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 340 - iDepApp : 1
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 340 - iWaypoint : 1
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 340 - iWPDest : 7
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 340 - ***********************
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 340 - Checking if we're talking to Approach yet....
01/01/2014 15:22:07: 340 - iWaypoint: 1 iWPDest: 7 iAppf: 118.15 ComFreq: 132.2 iDestAppFlag: 0

Those last two lines reoccur over and over again during the silence. My COM frequency is still set to 132.2. ATC has not given any instructions to change it (I searched the whole log file): I have radio frequencies set in PFE to change automatically upon instruction from ATC, and that is normally what happens, but if ATC don't ask me to change, PFE does nothing of course and I stay on the old frequency. There are no more entries in the log after 15:19:15 which start "Transcript: 'Iberia 200 Contact...."

So, ATC having gone quiet on me again, I paused the flight and looked at the PFE log, as above. I found that PFE was expecting me to be on 118.15, so I manually tuned to that frequency, and then, hey presto, ATC was back on line...

Given the log, I can't see that it is me doing something wrong here! No instruction to change frequency was given by PFE. I guess that's what happens every time ATC stops responding. No way I can tell what frequency I am supposed to be on without stopping the flight and searching the log file, as far as I can see - when this happens I don't get the usual little window popping up which, when you try to contact ATC but are on the wrong frequency, shows both the frequency you're currently on and the frequency you should be on.

I can email you the whole log if you want Dave! Or can post other extracts...

Comments appreciated,

Martin :)
Author:  martinlest [ Sun Jan 05, 2014 6:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ATC goes dead mid-flights
Update: (This seems to be happening more and more these days, ATC goes 'dead')....

When I looked through the log today, I had (according to my text software), over 1800 instances (!) there of the following lines:

05/01/2014 16:43:22: 400 - Checking if we're talking to Approach yet....
05/01/2014 16:43:22: 400 - iWaypoint: 4 iWPDest: 10 iAppf: 118.5 ComFreq: 125.7 iDestAppFlag: 0

Does that mean I should be on 118.5 to communicate with ATC? I guess so, as if I change to 118.5 manually, I re-establish contact. But ATC never instructed me to change to that frequency - I listened carefully today, specifically, but it never came - and then to be sure, I searched the log for 'Transcript:' and 'Contact' The last one in the log is for 125.7:

05/01/2014 16:11:03: 460 - Transcript: 'Aero Fox 6616 Contact CONTROL on 125.7'
05/01/2014 16:11:08: 650 - --> subPlayDigits called with value: 125
05/01/2014 16:11:08: 650 - --> subPlayDigits called with value: 7
05/01/2014 16:11:08: 680 -
05/01/2014 16:11:08: 680 - SayPFSentence:- ProFlightV\pf1E,ProFlightV\pf2E,ProFlightV\pf5E,ProFlightV\pfchat500E,ProFlightV\pf7E,ProFlightV\pfac167E,ProFlightV\pf6E,ProFlightV\pf6E,ProFlightV\pf1E,ProFlightV\pf6E,pfclick
05/01/2014 16:11:08: 680 -
05/01/2014 16:11:08: 680 - Transcript: '125.7 Aero Fox 6616'
05/01/2014 16:11:13: 790 - COM Freq changed to: 125.7 IPC Set: 9577
05/01/2014 16:11:14: 790 - Not tuned to any 'active' ATC facility!
05/01/2014 16:11:15: 800 - COM Freq changed to: 125.7001 IPC Set: 9584

After that, nothing from ATC and they don't respond to any input.

This isn't something I am doing wrong, is it?

Thanks, as ever...

Martin
Author:  Dave March [ Sun Jan 05, 2014 8:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ATC goes dead mid-flights
Did you ask ATC for a different altitude during your flight at all? There is a small bug with that feature which I 'think' I've fixed, but am awaiting feedback from a few testers.
Author:  martinlest [ Sun Jan 05, 2014 9:25 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: ATC goes dead mid-flights
Hi Dave, thanks. No, I didn't. I've read about that bug, so don't ask for an altitude change without being prepared for the possible consequences (I sometimes ask for an altitude change - rare in any case - and ATC continues fine) .

Now approaching the end of my flight and I get this - ATC isn't responding again (I'm on 118.5, but, at the end, I see "Failed 'contact approach'"?? (extract below).

I know this must be hard for you to troubleshoot 'at distance'! I am a bit discouraged by all these things going wrong now - I wish I could just sit back fly - but I'll stick with it to sort out what's going on. I suppose you must be a bit fed up of all this too by now Dave! :-)

05/01/2014 21:32:15: 840 - Checking if we're talking to Approach yet....
05/01/2014 21:32:15: 840 - iWaypoint: 9 iWPDest: 10 iAppf: 118.5 ComFreq: 118.5 iDestAppFlag: 0
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - ComFreq: 118.5
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - iLastFreq: 118.6
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - DYCAgain: 0
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - iTowerOrigFreqL: 118.55
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - iTwr: 1
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - iDepFL: 118.6
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - iAppFL: 119.7
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - iAppL: 0
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - iCtrF: 125.7
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - iCtr: 0
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 600 - Failed 'contact approach' checks!
05/01/2014 21:33:13: 650 - WP: 9 iCtrF: 125.7 iCtrFTmp: 125.7 iCenterN
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