OnCourse Software

With all the talk about the "Randomizer" it is time for me to get deeper in PF3 before I start trying to figure Randomizer out.

I have been very satisfied with my experiences with PF3 default settings without getting into setting things up on the STAR/SID page.
The one question that comes to me right away after reading the manual and exploring the page is;
What is the best source to use for the information required for each SID and STAR, ie. Alt. Comp and MAp Alt, and for the Transition Altitude/Minimum FAF for an airport? Hopefully it isn't chart by chart!
Any ideas appreciated!
Thanks
Dave

Transition altitude will generally depend on country, eg USA is 18000 but UK is 6000 but individual airports can have a different figure depending on terrain.

The rest are all runway dependant and although the majority of airports will have identical or very similar numbers for each runway there can be significant differences, again mainly dependant on terrain during the approach/missed approach procedure. The only way to check for sure is to use the charts.

pschlute wrote:

Transition altitude will generally depend on country, eg USA is 18000 but UK is 6000 but individual airports can have a different figure depending on terrain.

The rest are all runway dependant and although the majority of airports will have identical or very similar numbers for each runway there can be significant differences, again mainly dependant on terrain during the approach/missed approach procedure. The only way to check for sure is to use the charts.

Unfortunately charts are you best source. Principally because airports will often have their own transition altitudes as well. For your Final Approach Altitude that will be the intercept altitude with the glide slope and will be identified in the ILS charts.
In ICAO there is a slight difference regarding FAF. Apart from it being termed FAP "Final Approach Point". So the FAP distance is the distance at which you are expected to intercept the glideslope. Currently PF3 has set 7nm as the default value. This translates to 10-11nm from the threshold in the sim if the glideslope is 3deg. and your approach is 3,000ft agl. So for a large majority of airports it doesn't need to be changed. But you do need to check first.
Bear in mind also that FAF/FAP altitude is QNH and not height above ground. So in this chart below you see 4,000ft as the FAF altitude which in the case of Torino is 3,000agl. The numbers on the scale with "D" in front refer to DME NOT GPS. DME on an ILS facility is measured from the ILS localier which is at the opposite end of the rwy to your landing so it will disagree with your GPS by at least 1nm!
If you fly in Europe our best source is Eurocontrol as all European nations must file changes and updates with them. You will have to register though.
Another point to consider is your afcad file. They quite often disagree with the real charts so may need updating. Flight planning does unfortunately require a little work

dave39 wrote:

With all the talk about the "Randomizer" it is time for me to get deeper in PF3 before I start trying to figure Randomizer out.

I have been very satisfied with my experiences with PF3 default settings without getting into setting things up on the STAR/SID page.
The one question that comes to me right away after reading the manual and exploring the page is;
What is the best source to use for the information required for each SID and STAR, ie. Alt. Comp and MAp Alt, and for the Transition Altitude/Minimum FAF for an airport? Hopefully it isn't chart by chart!
Any ideas appreciated!
Thanks
Dave

It really all depends on the level of realism you wish to attain. For some, PF3 will work straight out of the box without having to add any additional information. It's really your choice but if you do want it 'as real as it gets' then yes, charts would be the only way to add the relevant data into PF3. However, you only have to do this once for each airport you're flying to/from and you would obviously only do it as and when you are planning your flight, rather than sitting down for an evening to update all those airports you think you are likely to be using.

Thanks for the replies. Great to see! So this is where it ties into the debate about tying PF3 to navigraph or not. Correct me if I'm wrong; if I update my airac cycle then the SID/STAR entries I have made for an airport could/would change??? So it is best to enter the information on a flight by flight basis or settle into on airac cycle and stay with it for awhile??

Appreciate the explanation vololiberista, but there's one I hadn't thought of, how do I update my afcads??? Is this why on occasion I find something like a VOR frequency that doesn't seem to be working?


Thanks!! You continue to offer the triple "A" standard in product support.

Regards
Dave

Quote:

if I update my airac cycle then the SID/STAR entries I have made for an airport could/would change???

Yes, but then why would you want to use both. The easiest way to use SID/STARS in PF3 is to simply set them to active which means your SID will end at the first waypoint in your FP and the last waypoint will be the start of your STAR. So you can then fly whatever procedure you want up to the first waypoint and any procedure you wish after the final waypoint. Couldn't be simpler. Again, it's all down to how you would like to do things.

I hope you don't mind me asking this, but I generally depart via a Sid and fly either vectors or star for approach's.

In my case would it be better for me to make SID'S active and leave STAR's as not active?

Regards Rob

This might be good occasion to ask this question because it is related to the SID/STAR setup:

It is about the terminology PF3 uses when clearance for approach is given. I've heard different clearances and I am not sure if it is a bug of PF3 (probably not), if I did setup something wrong or if it is just intended that way.

So could you please clarify what the clearance terminology of PF3 should be in the following situations (with the STAR option set and the default Sierra Tango name):

1. no Start of STAR defined (on the Adjust ... Flight Plan page): What clearance do I get at my last waypoint?
2. Start of STAR defined: What clearance do I get at the Start of STAR and what clearance do I get at my last waypoint?
3. And what if I defined the last waypoint as Start of STAR? Does that make any difference to not defining a Start of STAR at all?

Thank you!

Ralf

dave39 wrote:

Thanks for the replies. Great to see! So this is where it ties into the debate about tying PF3 to navigraph or not. Correct me if I'm wrong; if I update my airac cycle then the SID/STAR entries I have made for an airport could/would change??? So it is best to enter the information on a flight by flight basis or settle into on airac cycle and stay with it for awhile??

Appreciate the explanation vololiberista, but there's one I hadn't thought of, how do I update my afcads??? Is this why on occasion I find something like a VOR frequency that doesn't seem to be working?


Thanks!! You continue to offer the triple "A" standard in product support.

Regards
Dave

You should have either afcad2.exe at the bottom of this page http://library.avsim.net/search.php?Sea ... e=0&Page=3

or Airport Design Editor from here http://www.scruffyduck.org/airport-desi ... 4584106799
If the VOR is on the airfield then that might be the reason it isn't working ie not present in the afcad file. Otherwise if it is just an enroute navigation facility then it might be missing from your sim database.

Further to Dave's reply about PF3 being easy to use:

if you are flying into an airport that does not have challenging terrain (most of them), then you will automatically be vectored and given descent instructions that get you to intercept the LOC/GP somewhere between 2000 and 3000 feet, which more often than not will be identical or very close to the published procedure for that airport. Only if you know the airport has a challenging approach due to terrain which requires a higher FAF would you need to edit the airport details.