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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2017 6:03 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 8:27 pm
Posts: 1110
I can only assume it could be down to our operating systems or Dave M has slightly altered FDC, I know years back when Flight Deck Companion came out it used to work like you describe.
Personally I would like to see a Fully Auto Checklist, Semi Auto and Full Manual (3 stages of checks not 4)
So far I used a Cessna 172 and 737-700 both went through the checks one after the other.
Message Dave M to see if he has any suggestions.

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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 03, 2017 8:24 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2010 4:33 pm
Posts: 815
Quote:
So far I used a Cessna 172 and 737-700 both went through the checks one after the other.
Not clear what you mean Dave - 'checks' or 'checklists'? The individual check items ('Battery Switch', 'Nav Lights', 'Beacon Lights' etc. etc.) within one complete checklist should of course run one after the other in Auto Mode, only pausing if there is an error (and that aspect is working fine). What shouldn't happen with the first three checklists (where the pdf indicates that a user keyboard input is needed to move on to the next one) is that when one of those first checklists comes to an end (e.g. Pre-Start Checks), the next one (Before Pushback checks) starts up automatically with no user keyboard input - I am getting those first three checklists running with hardly a pause between them (with the aircraft I mentioned).

Is that what was happening with your C170 and B737 then, checklists starting up with no keyboard input??


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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2017 4:25 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 8:27 pm
Posts: 1110
Yes I get that aswell. used both stock and 3rd party aircraft...personally and I may create a wish list in this forum to have checklists changed to as I said earlier.
Fully Auto where everything runs from the start after hitting CTRL+ Spacebar.
Semi Auto where you have to do as you described and then Full Manual where everything is done by user.
I don't think the pdf has been updated as it still says it can be used with older versions of FS...I believe FDC LiveCockpit is for FS2004,FSX and P3D.

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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:07 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2010 4:33 pm
Posts: 815
Quote:
Fully Auto where everything runs from the start after hitting CTRL+ Spacebar.
Just to be 100% clear, on Full Auto, one check item follows another within one checklist set, unless an error occurs (I forgot to turn on the beacon light, for instance, before pushback). When that happens I correct the item and hit Ctrl+Spacebar again: the item is repeated by FDC and, assuming the oversight has been corrected, the reply is 'On', 'OK' or whatever, and the next checklist item is read out. At the end of the Pre-start checks FDC then waits (even on Auto1) till I hit Ctrl+Spacebar again before it starts reading out the Before Pushback checklist. And again, when that finishes, FDC waits for Ctrl+Spacebar before starting the Before (engine) Start checklist. From the next checklist set onwards, 'After Start Checks', each checklist set begins on its own, at points desinated as in the pdf file and FDC no longer waits for a Ctrl+Spacebar input from the user.

That is what happens in all the a/c I use (and I assume that that is what you mean when you say this is what you get, with all your aircraft) - and that is great, exactly as I like it these days (I tend to forget to initiate checklists these days if its left to my memory - having no co-pilot or capatain in my room to prompt me!), apart from (so far) the two I mentioned, when the first three checklists run with no input from me. If there is an error within a checklist, I have to correct it, but when the whole list has been finished, FDC starts the next one without waiting. I have to use the Pause FDC key to stop it going on long before I am ready. You aren't experiencing that, are you Dave? Maybe you (or anyone else who can be bothered!) could install the CamSim CS100/CS300 (AVSIM freeware) and see if you get what I do. I have attached my FDC files for this aircraft, to make it easy for anyone to do this. (Is there an error in my files that is causing the Auto_Ctrl_Space, maybe?? Use any of the profile BTW, I set up multiple ones with specific choices according to geographical area - pilot voices etc.).


Attachments:
FDC.zip [29.82 KiB]
Downloaded 3 times


Last edited by martinlest on Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:28 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:13 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 6:22 pm
Posts: 3131
Quote:
Quote:
Fully Auto where everything runs from the start after hitting CTRL+ Spacebar.
Just to be 100% clear, on Full Auto, one check item follows another within one checklist set, unless an error occurs (I forgot to turn on the beacon light, for instance, before pushback). When that happens I correct the item and hit Ctrl+Spacebar again: the item is repeated by FDC and, assuming the oversight has been corrected, the reply is 'On', 'OK' or whatever, and the next checklist item is read out. At the end of the Pre-start checks FDC then waits (even on Auto1) till I hit Ctrl+Spacebar again before it starts reading out the Before Pushback checklist. And again, when that finishes, FDC waits for Ctrl+Spacebar before starting the Before (engine) Start checklist. From the next checklist set onwards, 'After Start Checks', each checklist set begins on its own, at points desinated as in the pdf file and FDC no longer waits for a Ctrl+Spacebar input from the user.

That is what happens in all the a/c I use - and is great, exactly as I like it these days (I tend to forget to initiate checklists these days if its left to my memory - having no co-pilot or capatain in my room to prompt me!), apart from (so far) the two I mentioned, when the first three checklists run with no input from me. If there is an error within a checklist, I have to correct it, but when the whole list has been finished, FDC starts the next one without waiting. I have to use the Pause FDC key to stop it going on long before I am ready
With the aircraft you're having issues with, do they use hotkeys at all? It sounds like they are initiating the same hotkey that FDC regards as 'start the next checklist'

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Dave March

Email: dmarch@oncourse-software.co.uk

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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 04, 2017 10:20 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2010 4:33 pm
Posts: 815
Thanks for joining in Dave! I did look for hotkeys, yes, but I didn't find anything. I also tried pressing Ctrl+Space in both a/c, with FDC off, but nothing happened that I noticed. I'll double check this however, maybe I missed something. I can also try changing the Ctrl+Spacebar hotkey to something else and see if the same thing happens... (will post back results when I have done this).

That would leave the question though, why do the FDC logs show 'Auto Ctrl_Space'? If the a/c were giving the keyboard input, wouldn't the logs just record 'Ctrl_Space'?


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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:51 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2010 4:33 pm
Posts: 815
I have now found five aircraft where the first three checklists (I repeat, I don't mean check items within a list) run one after the other in Auto1 mode - including my default Cessna 208B (this is FS9, just to be clear). I have tried changing the pro file for that aircraft with a different (flaps compatible) one, so there's a different .uco file too, but still after a short pause the Before Pushback checklist begins by itself after the Pre-Start one finishes, with no input from me; and then the Before Start checklist runs as well. I tried changing the panel back to the FS9 one (I use a third-party panel for the C208B), but still the 2nd. and 3rd. checklists - the ones where you are supposed to enter Ctrl+Space to get them to start - come up automatically (the Prestart still needs a Ctrl+Space entry after you connect FDC).

Going back to, say, a PMDG 737 or PSS A320, everything is fine. So could the problem be somewhere in the aircraft.cfg or .air file??? I am at a loss. With these five aircraft (that I have found so far) the FDC log shows the 'Auto Ctrl_Space' entry. Any clues as to how/why that is being generated? It seems to come from FDC, not from something else in FS9.

For the a/c with this issue, I have gone back to semi-auto mode (and the checklists do not start up by themselves in that mode), but it would be good to be able to get to the bottom of this. Let me know if you need any further logs or of any other troubleshooting steps I can make to help.

Martin


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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 1:19 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 6:22 pm
Posts: 3131
Is this your own checklist of a default one?

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Dave March

Email: dmarch@oncourse-software.co.uk

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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 2:02 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2010 4:33 pm
Posts: 815
All five aircraft have different checklists (some are turboprops, others jets etc.). They are 'mine' but just created via the FDC insterface, checking the various boxes and saving them in the usual way.

Also, the same checklists (I have a generic 'Turboprop' checklist for instance) are used by other a/c that don't seem to have this issue...


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 Post subject: Re: Auto Mode 'broken'?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 2:50 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 6:22 pm
Posts: 3131
Okay, I need to find the courage to check out the code... but it's been more than 15 years since I wrote that and there's bound to be a lot of rust to get through!!! Especially in my grey matter!!! :shock:

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Dave March

Email: dmarch@oncourse-software.co.uk

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